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09-01-2013, 01:58 AM
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#91
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clean money
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Maryland
Posts: 23,562
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nijinski
And it was E Guillot"s brother Chip who started this whole thing and I would
wager that he had a nice wager on Moreno
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Agreed., that there's either a big wager , or serious Bragging Rights on the line!
$25.40 $9.80 not a bad door prize for Moreno, considering it was no secret that he'd get the lead and be uncontested early by the 2 favorites (Palace Malice and Verrazano).
All you needed was faith in the horse - something Guillot bros have in droves.
__________________
Preparation. Discipline. Patience. Decisiveness.
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09-01-2013, 03:28 AM
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#92
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 3,550
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cordep17
watched it a few times more.
Definitely looks to be a handoff---Im just not sure why the other jockey would be in it...
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Pat day also rode a Lukas trained horse that day.. of course, yet another note from that day is that the pacesetter Serena's Song was also a lukas horse.. soooooooo were they all connected by wifi buzzers?
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09-01-2013, 04:25 AM
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#93
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C'est Tout
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Cajunland
Posts: 13,281
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All this talk of "suspicious" or "peculiar" movements by Saez is total bull.
Just what was suspicious?
he switched his whip from one hand to the other?
he untied the knot in the reins?
after untying the knot he dropped his hands and let all the rein out?
Did anyone watch the replays and still shots on the NBC telecast today?
They slowed and showed all the "crucial moments" where Saez may have done something "suspicious"...they even show his right hand open, and guess what, it's empty. Then they move the tape forward a bit to when he opens his left hand...and again, nothing.
Bottom line:
Saez and Lukas are innocent
Guillot is a prick
__________________
How do I work this?
-David Byrne
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09-01-2013, 04:36 AM
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#94
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Veteran
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 25,607
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Unfortunately for the "tin foil hat" crowd i found a camera angle on the 1995 Derby that sort of indicates that Gary Stevens is innocent of all charges. There's a low camera angle on a video i found that shows Gary twirl his stick in his right hand right after the wire (and before the "handoff") and then shows him open his hand. Now, the camera cuts the video of the bottom of his hand off, so you can't see if he dropped anything out of his hand when it opened up, but you can see his right hand open about 5 seconds before his handshake with Pat Day.
You can see this at 17:10 on this video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G27sCLfyMgQ
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09-01-2013, 04:55 AM
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#95
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Veteran
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 25,607
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PhantomOnTour
All this talk of "suspicious" or "peculiar" movements by Saez is total bull.
Just what was suspicious?
he switched his whip from one hand to the other?
he untied the knot in the reins?
after untying the knot he dropped his hands and let all the rein out?
Did anyone watch the replays and still shots on the NBC telecast today?
They slowed and showed all the "crucial moments" where Saez may have done something "suspicious"...they even show his right hand open, and guess what, it's empty. Then they move the tape forward a bit to when he opens his left hand...and again, nothing.
Bottom line:
Saez and Lukas are innocent
Guillot is a prick
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Racing has a bad reputation right now of sweeping things under the rug and has a huge transparency problem, to come down hard on Guillot, who is essentially a whistleblower here, is the wrong message i think.
Guillot isnt well liked right now but i have to admit, as a bettor, i would rather have a blustery Guillot (or a blustery Dutrow) say something about what he thinks he saw than a trainer who might just keep it to himself.
Last edited by Stillriledup; 09-01-2013 at 04:57 AM.
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09-01-2013, 05:47 AM
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#96
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Registered User
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 217
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slow motion
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09-01-2013, 08:07 AM
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#97
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Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Audubon, PA
Posts: 427
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Clearly shows an empty right hand at 39 seconds. I think he as just switching the reins, pretty sure of that. What do others think?
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09-01-2013, 08:52 AM
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#98
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 1,353
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Was it a disposable "buzzer" or are we entertaining in the world of Dick Frances?
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09-01-2013, 09:16 AM
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#99
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 5,414
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Quote:
Originally Posted by statepierback
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now that video ought to put this thing to rest. the part where he pulled his right hand off and still had his hand clenched when he brought it to his thigh and then back to his reins was the part on the full speed video that made it look very sketchy. But this video nullifies that for sure.
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09-01-2013, 09:37 AM
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#100
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Just another Facist
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Now in Houston
Posts: 52,844
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somebody get that horse whisper dude to ask the horse
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09-01-2013, 11:05 AM
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#101
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C'est Tout
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Cajunland
Posts: 13,281
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whistleblower?...huh?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stillriledup
Racing has a bad reputation right now of sweeping things under the rug and has a huge transparency problem, to come down hard on Guillot, who is essentially a whistleblower here, is the wrong message i think.
Guillot isnt well liked right now but i have to admit, as a bettor, i would rather have a blustery Guillot (or a blustery Dutrow) say something about what he thinks he saw than a trainer who might just keep it to himself.
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Your first paragraph is ridiculous - there is nothing to sweep under the rug here, and Guillot is not a whistleblower.
Learn the difference between a whistleblower and a sore losing whiner.
There are different levels of not "keeping it to himself"...you do know it's possible to file the complaint without talking to folks in the racing press.
It's also possible to answer questions with "let's let things play out" then the punk ass allegations he is throwing around.
__________________
How do I work this?
-David Byrne
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09-01-2013, 11:10 AM
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#102
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 930
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stillriledup
Racing has a bad reputation right now of sweeping things under the rug and has a huge transparency problem, to come down hard on Guillot, who is essentially a whistleblower here, is the wrong message i think.
Guillot isnt well liked right now but i have to admit, as a bettor, i would rather have a blustery Guillot (or a blustery Dutrow) say something about what he thinks he saw than a trainer who might just keep it to himself.
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Guillot never saw anything until his brother talk him into this BS.
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09-01-2013, 11:23 AM
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#103
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Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 930
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The minute Saez is cleared which will be soon, he should call his lawyer and sue this phony cry baby sour loser for everything that his got.
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09-01-2013, 11:43 AM
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#104
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broken-down horseplayer
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Portland, OR area
Posts: 2,090
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TurfRuler
Was it a disposable "buzzer" or are we entertaining in the world of Dick Frances?
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Disposable buzzers are usually dropped after the wire, going around the turn. That's one of the problems with the Thunder Gulch Derby - why not just drop the damn thing rather than risk a handoff? The other problem is that like Will Take Charge in this year's Travers, I didn't see Thunder Gulch's tail show the buzz behavior by snapping violently - that alone doesn't mean he wasn't buzzed, but it makes it less likely.
As for the world of Dick Francis, I don't recall any of his novels mentioning or using a buzzer - though one of his stories revolves around conditioning horses with a flamethrower and high-pitched whistle, resulting in a surge of adrenalin from the fear of being burned.
__________________
Playing SRU Downs - home of the "no sweat" inquiries...
Defying the "laws" of statistics with every wager.
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09-01-2013, 12:00 PM
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#105
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 3,550
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Guys.. I have a new theory
Someone had a voodoo doll of Jose Ortiz and punched it right during the end of the stretch near.. this could have been a bettor who had big money riding on WTC.
Check also
http://www.bing.com/images/search?q=...ng&FORM=HDRSC2
By the way I got there by trying to find out what these buzzers look like.. I mean, for all this chatter,.. no one has actually posted one link to what these darned buzzers look like!!
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