How was there no inquiry for 2nd?

[46zilzal]

Originally Posted by PalaceOfFortLarned

Race came down to a photo finish among 3 horses, and yet the bumping didn't change the order of finish?

I got the raw end of it all with the , and I'm fine with it, but to say it had nothing to do with the finish?

I won't go into my YEARS of being tutored by the stewards at Woodbine in differentiating what incidental bumping did to outcome, but I learned rom repeated examples what the judges of racing taught me.

[PalaceOfFortLarned]

Originally Posted by 46zilzal

I won't go into my YEARS of being tutored by the stewards at Woodbine in differentiating what incidental bumping did to outcome, but I learned rom repeated examples what the judges of racing taught me.

I'm not complaining.

I think the final results are what should have been

Would the 2 be DQ'd on every other circuit outside the US. Yes.

It hurt. Bad. But part of the capping we have to do. And until our rules change, then that is the part of 'capping we have to do.

I punted Fierceness cause I fully felt he was weak. That is very much a part of handicapping races in the US in big fields. Is your horse tough enough?

[Ruffian1]

I think it starts with consistency. Is this ok everyday in Ky ?
If so, ok. But if not except Derby day, that’s showing something different.

And being strict as Stewards or loose is an ebb and flow thing. If they call it loose and it gets out of hand, the Stewards will crack the whip, right the ship for the safety of all involved and typically slowly allow it to be loose again. If that is their style.

Or it’s called somewhat tighter or very tight.

Just depends on how the stewards call everyday. It needs to stay consistent at each venue. At least that’s how I was shown it was. I assume it’s the same overview today. I don’t know why it wouldn’t be.

[classhandicapper]

Originally Posted by classhandicapper

That's why I raised the question about whether the Japanese rider/owner knew the standards and protocols for DQs in the US and could also communicate their objection in English in a timely enough fashion given possible language barrier. Pure speculation, but it's possible they were too polite or could not communicate the objection.

Right or wrong, I still think the reason there was no stewards inquiry or DQ was because it was the Derby and they have historically allowed more physicality in the Derby than some random race on any other day.

Apparently the rider of Forever Young did not think what happened warranted a foul claim. That's at least what I read he said after the race.

[Bullet Plane]

Originally Posted by classhandicapper

Apparently the rider of Forever Young did not think what happened warranted a foul claim. That's at least what I read he said after the race.

Owner Susumu Fujita’s racing manager, Hiroshi Ando said:

“Claims of foul do not happen much in Japan. It is the stewards’ call, not us.”

Perhaps like NBA playoffs, they allow a rougher game in the big one.

Either way, the race I'd really like to see is the Mystic Dan - Sierra Leone rematch. And so would everybody else. That's what made the triple crown trail so exciting. Seeing the rematches. I'll Have Another - Bodemeister was the last big one that I can remember.

But, of course, we are not going to be able to see it. And they wonder why the popularity of the sport is fading away.

Of course, I would like to see Forever Young there too. But it is understandable that the Japanese would rather race in their own country with bigger purses at this point.

[Hoops McCann]

Originally Posted by Bullet Plane

Owner Susumu Fujita’s racing manager, Hiroshi Ando said:

“Claims of foul do not happen much in Japan. It is the stewards’ call, not us.”

Perhaps like NBA playoffs, they allow a rougher game in the big one.

Either way, the race I'd really like to see is the Mystic Dan - Sierra Leone rematch. And so would everybody else. That's what made the triple crown trail so exciting. Seeing the rematches. I'll Have Another - Bodemeister was the last big one that I can remember.

But, of course, we are not going to be able to see it. And they wonder why the popularity of the sport is fading away.

Of course, I would like to see Forever Young there too. But it is understandable that the Japanese would rather race in their own country with bigger purses at this point.

we will likely see the rematch at the same distance in 5 weeks at Saratoga. and yes, Forever Young is headed back to Japan. good chance we'll see him at the Breeders Cup

[Roaring Good Time]

If I were the racing czar what happened there wouldn't be an infraction. You had two horses acting like the herd animals they are and trying to dominate one another. Both riders were doing their best to get the horses off each other and neither jock did anything dangerous.

But I'm not the czar and if that same situation had occurred in a first level allowance race on a Thursday at Ellis Park, there's no doubt Sierra Leone is dropped a spot.

[ubercapper]

Originally Posted by classhandicapper

That's why I raised the question about whether the Japanese rider/owner knew the standards and protocols for DQs in the US and could also communicate their objection in English in a timely enough fashion given possible language barrier. Pure speculation, but it's possible they were too polite or could not communicate the objection.

Right or wrong, I still think the reason there was no stewards inquiry or DQ was because it was the Derby and they have historically allowed more physicality in the Derby than some random race on any other day.

I read a quote from Forever Young's connects which said they don't lodge objections in Japan and leave it to the officials. That is the reason the jockey did not object.

[Redboard]

Originally Posted by cj

One rider did nothing wrong and deserved no blame.

Yep. When they made the turn, all Forever Young did was try to run straight. Sierra Leone started at the 8th path(at the turn) and ended up in the three path. I don't want to hear this is how horses run. If they're going to let jocks get away with this, then jocks will be forced to do it. The trainers will make them.

With 17 million people watching this race, here is a chance for racing to grow. We all know what's going to eventually happen in this 20 horse field race. I don't have to say it. One would think that Churchill downs would do everything they could to lower the chances of it happening.

A complete joke.

[denniswilliams]

Wonder what happens if Forever Young's jock doesn't repeatedly stick lefty upon straightening out. Of course, SL has a habit of getting in but not for the length of the stretch. Continual lefty whipping by FY's jock, until midstretch where he goes rightly again before switching lefty late stretch, had a lot to do with getting all of this nonsense started and persisting. Both jocks should be fined.

Here's a Steward's incident report from race 6 (622) at Sha Tin on 4/28/24- where for sure I thought a horse was coming down, as it took the path of the 2nd horse late stretch.

' After considering the evidence, the Stewards found that leaving the 150 Metres TOP GUN shifted in, crowding the running of SECOND TO NONE for some distance which resulted in both runners making contact approaching the 100 Metres. The Stewards also found that over the final 50 Metres SECOND TO NONE was afforded clear running during which period SECOND TO NONE failed to make any ground on TOP GUN. After considering the manner in which both horses finished the race off, the Stewards were satisfied that had the interference not occurred after the 150 Metres, TOP GUN would have still finished in advance of SECOND TO NONE, the protest/objection was overruled .'

Can't argue with that.

[HottalkersinKY]

the stewards have called gafflione in on may 9th to discuss his ride in the derby
i am hearing they have video of him pushing on the japan jockey
why no inquiry

[PalaceOfFortLarned]

Originally Posted by Redboard

Yep. When they made the turn, all Forever Young did was try to run straight. Sierra Leone started at the 8th path(at the turn) and ended up in the three path. I don't want to hear this is how horses run. If they're going to let jocks get away with this, then jocks will be forced to do it. The trainers will make them.

With 17 million people watching this race, here is a chance for racing to grow. We all know what's going to eventually happen in this 20 horse field race. I don't have to say it. One would think that Churchill downs would do everything they could to lower the chances of it happening.

A complete joke.

It almost happened in 2019, and we got very lucky.

Very very lucky.

[bisket]

I watched the head on this morning. Sierra Leone knocked Forever Young’s rear side ways 4 times in the stretch.

[groupie doll]

Originally Posted by HottalkersinKY

the stewards have called gafflione in on may 9th to discuss his ride in the derby
i am hearing they have video of him pushing on the japan jockey
why no inquiry

He got fined 2500.

https://www.drf.com/news/gaffalione-...cky-derby-ride